Wireless Application Protocol? What's the problem?
No, seriously, thanks for writing this, Charles. This is a very important post. I think it goes hand in hand with many other things going on in American culture. If you lived outside the US for almost two decades as I did, it was shocking to come back and be hit with this and a lot of other unexpected cultural changes, as it's not like this elsewhere (as you point out).
I have some theories about what's going on, but the one thing I will say is that women have always been sexualized in one way or another in the music/entertainment business but it was kept within certain bounds. I think some of the blame goes to online porn, as you mention, and the expectations that that has created. But what's weird is that the pop audience is primarily female and gay, yet these pop stars are seemingly catering to male expectations. The question is why. Is the industry, run almost entirely by men, demanding this? Or are these women believing that it's necessary to keep their audiences?
There seems to be an inevitable backlash among the young. Hope it spreads before too much of the damage you point out is done to those generations.
Another topic on which I'd love to have more of your thoughts, especially given your background in psychology. The entire thing puzzles and saddens me. But there are bright spots. Lzzy Hale and The Warning, among others, have huge fan-bases made up of representative proportions of men and women, straight and gay. They could show the way, if people would pay attention!
Yes, it's certainly worth thinking more about because it's disturbing and disheartening, especially when you look at the stats on depression and anxiety among girls.
I keep thinking about how Britney was sexualized, but there was some empowerment mixed in. Madonna was transgressive sex and over-the-top don't-mess-with-me-unless-you-mean-it. But this seems an undermining of everything women worked to gain. But I don't follow pop anymore and don't really know what's going on in that space. I'll clearly have to do some reading on this!
I can't say I really "follow" pop but we sort of marinate in it anyway. One of the other related topics is the heavily gendered roles that men and women play in music, not just pop, but in rock, jazz, blues and hip-hop. Women are accepted as songwriters and singers, but not in any of the technical roles or as instrumentalists. This used to be the case in classical music but that changed radically over the past couple of generations, and now orchestras are often more than 50% women. Maybe we can learn from what happened there...?
Yes, it's a really important question. I keep reading cases of women taking on the producer role but never getting the money or credit. Women behind the console -- hey, don't touch that dial, girl!
Hopefully women getting good at instruments, and younger generations that have less patience for the gender expectations and stereotypes, may change all that.
Sad that so many women seem to be happy to trade respect for a $$. Sad commentary on society. You've shared with us many examples of women with extreme talent, but they don't have a fraction of the followers that any of these porn stars have. Too bad.
thanks for stopping to comment, Russ. Yes, it's weird that both the left and the right have their reasons for condemning actual pornography, but they have nothing to say about porn masquerading as pop culture.
Thanks for stopping by and commenting. Not all women go the soft porn route. Outside the U.S., very few do. I don't understand why the difference. The U.S. is much more overtly political where feminism is concerned, but it doesn't seem to carry over into popular music. thoughts?
Another reason why pop and rock music from Asia is gaining popularity. Yes they have the cute image and the sometimes sexy dances. But it has excellent music to accompany it as well as not relying on the porn image many Western female singers rely on. It is a great shame that we seem to have taken a backward step. Looking cheap and strutting around is supposed to be empowering. But if everybody does it, it just looks a bit sad. I shall stick with Band Maid and Trident and the rest of Japans rock women. While feeling a bit sad that Western Rock remains dull and predictable.
Wireless Application Protocol? What's the problem?
No, seriously, thanks for writing this, Charles. This is a very important post. I think it goes hand in hand with many other things going on in American culture. If you lived outside the US for almost two decades as I did, it was shocking to come back and be hit with this and a lot of other unexpected cultural changes, as it's not like this elsewhere (as you point out).
I have some theories about what's going on, but the one thing I will say is that women have always been sexualized in one way or another in the music/entertainment business but it was kept within certain bounds. I think some of the blame goes to online porn, as you mention, and the expectations that that has created. But what's weird is that the pop audience is primarily female and gay, yet these pop stars are seemingly catering to male expectations. The question is why. Is the industry, run almost entirely by men, demanding this? Or are these women believing that it's necessary to keep their audiences?
There seems to be an inevitable backlash among the young. Hope it spreads before too much of the damage you point out is done to those generations.
Another topic on which I'd love to have more of your thoughts, especially given your background in psychology. The entire thing puzzles and saddens me. But there are bright spots. Lzzy Hale and The Warning, among others, have huge fan-bases made up of representative proportions of men and women, straight and gay. They could show the way, if people would pay attention!
Yes, it's certainly worth thinking more about because it's disturbing and disheartening, especially when you look at the stats on depression and anxiety among girls.
I keep thinking about how Britney was sexualized, but there was some empowerment mixed in. Madonna was transgressive sex and over-the-top don't-mess-with-me-unless-you-mean-it. But this seems an undermining of everything women worked to gain. But I don't follow pop anymore and don't really know what's going on in that space. I'll clearly have to do some reading on this!
I can't say I really "follow" pop but we sort of marinate in it anyway. One of the other related topics is the heavily gendered roles that men and women play in music, not just pop, but in rock, jazz, blues and hip-hop. Women are accepted as songwriters and singers, but not in any of the technical roles or as instrumentalists. This used to be the case in classical music but that changed radically over the past couple of generations, and now orchestras are often more than 50% women. Maybe we can learn from what happened there...?
Yes, it's a really important question. I keep reading cases of women taking on the producer role but never getting the money or credit. Women behind the console -- hey, don't touch that dial, girl!
Hopefully women getting good at instruments, and younger generations that have less patience for the gender expectations and stereotypes, may change all that.
As I recall, I showed you a band called Nemophila, who call their genre "fluffy hell". I'd say they have figured it out!
Love it!
Sad that so many women seem to be happy to trade respect for a $$. Sad commentary on society. You've shared with us many examples of women with extreme talent, but they don't have a fraction of the followers that any of these porn stars have. Too bad.
thanks for stopping to comment, Russ. Yes, it's weird that both the left and the right have their reasons for condemning actual pornography, but they have nothing to say about porn masquerading as pop culture.
Talent does not require a soft core porn presentation, but sadly it seems to matter.
Thanks for stopping by and commenting. Not all women go the soft porn route. Outside the U.S., very few do. I don't understand why the difference. The U.S. is much more overtly political where feminism is concerned, but it doesn't seem to carry over into popular music. thoughts?
Another reason why pop and rock music from Asia is gaining popularity. Yes they have the cute image and the sometimes sexy dances. But it has excellent music to accompany it as well as not relying on the porn image many Western female singers rely on. It is a great shame that we seem to have taken a backward step. Looking cheap and strutting around is supposed to be empowering. But if everybody does it, it just looks a bit sad. I shall stick with Band Maid and Trident and the rest of Japans rock women. While feeling a bit sad that Western Rock remains dull and predictable.